What is a Geriatric Social Worker

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How can a Geriatric Social Worker help you and your family? Find out from special guest and Geriatric Social Worker, Valerie Juleson. Ms. Juleson has a Masters in Social Work from Columbia University and educates us on the different types of social work and how she helps families cope with aging issues.

Intro Vocalist:               (singing)

Greg McIntyre:             Hi, this is Greg McIntyre, and Brenton Begley.

Brenton Begley:            Hi.

Greg McIntyre:             McIntyre Elder Law, helping seniors protect their assets and legacies. And we are here today. We have a special show for you today. We’re going to spend some time with a social worker, who has a Master’s in Social Work from Columbia University, and she’s going to share some of her knowledge and wisdom with us today about what social work is, what a geriatric social worker does, and just how that can help you and your family. So without further ado, Ms. Juleson, thank you so much for being here today. May I call you Valerie, Valerie Juleson?

Valerie Juleson:             You absolutely can.

Greg McIntyre:             Okay. So Valerie, thank you for being with us today. You and I have worked together on a case in the past. You are a witness in a case in the past in a guardianship hearing and, which worked out wonderfully for the client. So, before I was an attorney and before I got into doing a lot of work with social services, and in that courtroom in juvenile court, and then moving on into being an elder law attorney, and working with social services and social workers in adult Medicaid and private social workers that work for facilities.

Greg McIntyre:             I didn’t know the difference. I didn’t understand that there were so many different types and varieties of social workers out there, and I would be willing to bet that a lot of people out there do not know the difference either, and don’t know that different types and varieties. And mainly, when I hear the term social work, or when I deal with clients, they just think if they’re working with a social worker, all social workers work for social services and that they’re there to simply help them. And while I’d love for that to be true-

Valerie Juleson:             Me too.

Greg McIntyre:             Social workers work for a number of different entities, in different capacities.

Valerie Juleson:             And have different priorities.

Greg McIntyre:             Sure. Sure.

Valerie Juleson:             Just like doctors, lawyers, dentists, everybody is different. Everybody’s unique. One thing I will be doing is emailing you some of the questions they should ask before they connect with people. I can’t make anybody’s choices, but I can give them the right questions. And I think that’s very important, whether you’re hiring any professional person to act with you.

Greg McIntyre:             Sure.

Valerie Juleson:             You have to interview them, and to interview them correctly, you need the questions.

Greg McIntyre:             Right.

Valerie Juleson:             My brand of social work is a little different. Let’s think of it as macro or micro. An LCSW is a clinically trained-

Greg McIntyre:             Licensed clinical social worker, LCSW, right?

Valerie Juleson:             Right. You see a lot of them working for facilities, hospitals-

Greg McIntyre:             Nursing homes, hospitals, assisted facilities.

Valerie Juleson:             And they have a very narrow definition of where they’re supposed to work with you. And if you take them out of that, it is against their job. I mean, they cannot, no more than you’re…

Greg McIntyre:             Than I’m going to handle a speeding ticket.

Valerie Juleson:             Thank you. [crosstalk 00:03:30] Okay. Right.

Valerie Juleson:             It doesn’t mean you don’t have your training, it just means that’s out of what you are going to do.

Greg McIntyre:             So it’s talking about focus. I hear you.

Valerie Juleson:             So I’m not saying anything against those that do this, they’re very good in their lane, in their zip code. Okay? And so if you don’t ask the right question, you’re never going to get the right information. So first of all, what are the, who pays? Why are they doing this? What experience do they have? Who have they helped in the past? Do they have references, et cetera, et cetera. Okay? So all of that is, mine is a little different. What I am trained to do this macro, not micro, macro.

Greg McIntyre:             So what does a geriatric social worker do?

Valerie Juleson:             The closest thing a good geriatric social worker and there’s all varieties of geriatrics.

Greg McIntyre:             Geriatric means-

Valerie Juleson:             The elders.

Greg McIntyre:             Working with someone who-

Valerie Juleson:             And their families.

Greg McIntyre:             Elderly. And their families, right.

Valerie Juleson:             So, if you are working with them, the best way for people to understand that, it’s like a general contract, or your GPS on your car, you need to get to Place A.

Valerie Juleson:             And so in order to, typical what I would work with is multiple businesses, when I was in Connecticut. I would have a situation, my husband was in real estate. You see, new real estate agent, I would have after ’07 when the market crashed. And we developed this because we weren’t seeing want-to-sell, we had have-to-sell. So Mama took care of Grandpa, and Grandpa is befuddled, and she just fell and broke her hip. They’ve got no planning. They didn’t even think of planning.

Greg McIntyre:             Sure.

Valerie Juleson:             So I’ve got to know who to call. I’ve got to call you. I’ve got to call a family, I’ve got to call a realtor I can trust. I’ve got to call someone who can come in and clear that house. You had one of those lovely ladies on one of your shows.

Greg McIntyre:             Sure. Thomas Palazzo, estate services.

Valerie Juleson:             So, I have to have all these resources. That’s what I mean by a GPS.

Greg McIntyre:             Right.

Valerie Juleson:             I have to know where the things are and I have to have checked them out, because they’re responsible for me.

Greg McIntyre:             Right.

Valerie Juleson:             Because while your grandma’s in getting her hip fixed, I’ve got grandpa, who’s befuddled. I’ve got to hire home care to take him to where he’s going to live in supported housing. So visually, even if he doesn’t remember, he knows it’s not a dangerous place. And he makes some buddies.

Brenton Begley:            Right. So if I’m kind of, the wheel’s turning in my head here, so I’m starting to think, if I’m telling someone, hey, you need some type of long-term care, we can help you get qualified for it, we can help protect your assets, we can get you Medicaid, that sort of thing. They would also want to work with someone like you to figure out some of the logistics, maybe, or even to point them in the right direction of how they can figure out some logistics if they came to us first, right? So where to go. Right? What-

Valerie Juleson:             Bingo.

Brenton Begley:            What place is the best place, how, and they’re going to, what it’s going to look like when they actually make that transition.

Valerie Juleson:             Yeah.

Brenton Begley:            Right.

Valerie Juleson:             And we’re not telling them who to hire. I always have at least three referrals that I’ve checked out and I’m the one who they’re responsible for, because if they mess up, they’re going to correct it or they’re off, they’re not getting another referral. They just wouldn’t be on my honor roll.

Brenton Begley:            Good.

Greg McIntyre:             I hope we’re on the honor roll.

Valerie Juleson:             You are. Okay. And so, when you have an honor roll that you can trust, it’s good for all the businesses. We are all mature enough to know the predators have already recognized the exponential growth in this vulnerable population.

Brenton Begley:            Right, right.

Valerie Juleson:             People are trying, and I’m including you, to put together a team that is protectors. That’s as simple as I can tell you. We have a vulnerable population. We will have predators, we will have protectors. We just want to give them the choice.

Greg McIntyre:             Plus you think that-

Brenton Begley:            Sorry, can you talk about that a little bit? That the, you mentioned the growing vulnerable population. Can you talk about, I guess what-

Valerie Juleson:             [crosstalk 00:07:39] One in five is now over sixty in the Charlotte area. I have some numbers here, but people watching, I could send them numbers, but the truth is one in five is already. The demographics are already over sixty.

Greg McIntyre:             Moving toward one in four.

Valerie Juleson:             Moving towards one in four.

Greg McIntyre:             Right.

Valerie Juleson:             So this has the Baby Boomers changed to Silver Tsunami.

Greg McIntyre:             The Silver Tsunami is what they call it.

Valerie Juleson:             Silver Tsunami. The Baby Boomers changed industry from the time we all got here. I’m one of them. Okay? Change the industry. Your business will be one of the front loaders of helping people get protected. The hardship is most people are in denial. Most people are frightened. You have all this knowledge and, you so want to give it to people, and you’re traveling in a Maserati and they’re in a Model T.

Brenton Begley:            Right.

Valerie Juleson:             How do you get the information absorbed? You’re working with people who have resistance, fear, delusion that their money’s going to protect them, or hopelessness that they have nothing that they can do. So, that is where we need a team of listeners, whether I was supervising students at senior centers, doing information, but they can only take a teaspoon in time-

Brenton Begley:            Right.

Valerie Juleson:             Then the whole reality, all at once. So I’m taking a couple of your books and putting them in the senior center.

Greg McIntyre:             Well, thank you.

Valerie Juleson:             And then I will talk about the books. But it is an inter-layered absorption, and it’s so hard because you can just see they’re at risk.

Brenton Begley:            Right.

Valerie Juleson:             And then they’re-

Brenton Begley:            I felt a lot of that denial, that fear, that reticence to make decisions. Greg, you felt that too, right? Speak to that a little bit on our side of the fence here, how we have really, in our experience with the client, how we experienced that.

Greg McIntyre:             Sure. And so our philosophy is, we’re going to give options, we’re going to first, first we start with people’s goals. We’re going to say, okay, what is your goal though? Because I need to identify your goal first. And then, we’re going to present options. There may be one option, two options, three options to achieve that goal. And then I will give my advice, my recommendation of [crosstalk 00:10:23] what I think, right? Then I start with a goal and then I back off to, okay, well to achieve that goal here, what, in my experience are your options to achieve that goal. If it’s stay in control of my home for the rest of my life and protect it, or stay in control of retirement assets or other assets, or it’s hey, I want to be covered by long term care insurance.

Greg McIntyre:             Right? I might make a referral for that. So, so it’s a holistic approach. And then you have to deal with, you mentioned we’re traveling in pretty fast and if somebody else might be traveling in a Model T, but that’s because they don’t do what we do every day.

Valerie Juleson:             Right.

Greg McIntyre:             So we have to bring them quickly up to speed, to stay with your analogy, right, with us so that they’re right along with us and understand. So, we try to do that as quickly as possible, and sometimes, I can tell you something over and over again and it may take a while to get through. So we use things like drawing on handheld pads, screens, that shadow on our televisions, on the bigger television like this behind us. In fact, we’re fitting, we already have one of the conference rooms fitted for that in Shelby, in this office that Brenton’s in, and we’re getting ready to fit another large TV there with it too. So Brenton can just simply throw all his notes and everything up on that screen and then draw things out.

Greg McIntyre:             I’m a very visual person. So we have maps that we will design for estate planning, or how lady bird deed works, or trust and the differences, that quickly point out the differences. And I know that if I can boil it down, sometimes it’s complicated to make things simple.

Valerie Juleson:             Yes, it is.

Greg McIntyre:             It takes a long time to make things, to understand how to make things simple. But I know that if I can take the complex, and boil it down as simply as possible and visually convey that, and maybe some bullet points that explain the differences, that’s a much better way to interact with anyone. It doesn’t matter if they’re a senior or not, but somebody who doesn’t do what you do all the time. But especially someone who is getting up in age, so to speak, right?

Greg McIntyre:             And our grandfather, who may be a bit befuddled, as you said, right? So, it’s easier to explain those things to them in that way. So we’d really explore it, play with different visual tools and maps and technology. And that’s innovation, to try to make things as simple as possible and convey those points within an hour-long consultation. Sometimes, there’s a lot of time and experience that goes into that, to be able to pull that down. Wouldn’t you agree, Brenton?

Brenton Begley:            Oh, yeah. I mean it just takes explaining it, over and over and over again, hours and hours of doing it, to really get to a point where you can put it into bite-size chunks. And Valerie, I’m sure you’ve had that experience too. Just trying to convey things in the simplest way possible to get the spirit of it over to them.

Valerie Juleson:             Yes, and I loved your explanation because it’s a classic goal, objectives and steps, whatever profession you’re in of helping, that is the classic blueprint-

Greg McIntyre:             That helps too. And Brenton, this is just, it’s a great discussion. I wanted to talk to you about, too, so we’ll do it here. That is a great way to, somebody might say, oh, well I don’t want to do that, right? Or I don’t like this plan, I like this plan, or I don’t like any of the plans. But then, you can go back and say, okay, well, your original goal is this. Your goal is this, this is how you get there, and then it puts it on them to figure that out, right. Does this jibe with my goals, does it help?

Greg McIntyre:             And really, I am less advising them at that point. I’m still laying out options, but they really are in control of the choices and then they can figure out, hey, to accomplish those goals, if I don’t go this route then I am kind of giving up control over here.

Valerie Juleson:             That’s right.

Greg McIntyre:             Or I’m getting, right. Yeah.

Valerie Juleson:             But I’m going to give you a hint.

Greg McIntyre:             Give me a hint.

Valerie Juleson:             Okay.

Greg McIntyre:             Tell me better. This is why I need the licensed clinical social worker.

Brenton Begley:            Yeah, yeah, exactly.

Greg McIntyre:             Also, why many families benefit from employing a geriatric social worker like Ms. Juleson. And I want to get into her experience and knowledge and education. Columbia is not an easy school to get into. I know that it’s not. How about that? I have a cousin, a first cousin that went to Columbia, for a while, and it’s on the backside of Central Park. Isn’t that where it is?

Valerie Juleson:             Yes, yes.

Greg McIntyre:             It’s right on the backside of Central Park in Manhattan. But before you get there, you were going to give me [crosstalk 00:15:18] some advice, a hint.

Valerie Juleson:             I’m going to give you a hint. Before you walk in.

Greg McIntyre:             Okay.

Valerie Juleson:             Before I walk in to see a family, or a person, I have a very easy thing that they fill out because if I’m talking to Grandma and she has been proud of her cooking, okay?

Greg McIntyre:             Okay, sure.

Valerie Juleson:             I’m going to put everything in the relationship of this is the recipe that’s going to work, honey. These are the ingredients we need to have, and we’re going to mix them together this way.

Greg McIntyre:             Right.

Valerie Juleson:             Because I’m using her pride. I’m using where she feels confident to take a new step.

Greg McIntyre:             Okay.

Valerie Juleson:             Okay? You have been a military man-

Greg McIntyre:             So you’re relating them. [crosstalk 00:15:57] You’re getting in their world, yeah.

Valerie Juleson:             Your words have told me, you are protective, you’re a fighter, you’re a scrapper.

Greg McIntyre:             Sure.

Valerie Juleson:             Which, I heard your words, you’re a military man.

Greg McIntyre:             I would agree with that, your interpretation.

Valerie Juleson:             Okay. Therefore, I’m going to say the same thing, tailored to your temperament.

Greg McIntyre:             Right.

Valerie Juleson:             If you go in there, and sell as a scrapper, and a military man, and a protector to Grandma, you’ve lost her.

Greg McIntyre:             Right. Because I’m not relating to her on her level.

Valerie Juleson:             It’s bilingual.

Greg McIntyre:             It’s just people.

Valerie Juleson:             It’s bilingual. I cannot talk to you in Japanese and expect you to answer me. What kind of, I can go on and you’ll go, I don’t have any idea what she said.

Greg McIntyre:             Yes.

Valerie Juleson:             Have to hear before you talk. You have to know who they are. If that is not your forte, then you get people who are good listeners and give you the report on how to direct it.

Brenton Begley:            Certainly, I think that has a good point. And you have to tailor the plan to who the person is and their goal, they’re going to tell you that. And also, really, the first part of a consultation with us, I’ve always experienced this, is always, it’s just listening. We just sit down, say hey, how can I help you? And we listen. Right? And the thing is, what I hear almost every time is: this probably doesn’t matter, this is probably not relevant, ongoing, on and on. And I just tell them, no, I need to know everything because all of it matters, all of it’s relevant. Because if anything is going to tell me who you are as a person, what you value, right? And that’s going to show me what your goals and what your needs are.

Valerie Juleson:             [inaudible 00:17:38]

Brenton Begley:            And that’s absolutely how we want to tailor it. And that’s, we don’t want to stray from that at all. If we’re talking to the children, we’re talking to the spouse, we’re talking to the social worker, right? We’re talking to the facility. Anyone, we want to make sure we convey that.

Valerie Juleson:             Right. The most important thing when I would work with the family, particularly, I’d be working with adult children. And there’s nobody at this table, I don’t care what your degree is, where you went to school, who knows more about your granddad than you.

Brenton Begley:            Right.

Valerie Juleson:             In this setting, you’re the expert, we’re the students. Please, tell us. There is nothing you can say that is not valuable to us in helping you reach it, because that’s the expert at the table. Even if your granddad got befuddled, you are the expert. I’m not, I don’t care where I went to school. Pointless, if I can’t listen.

Greg McIntyre:             Right, so tell us about Columbia and what that education means. MSW, Master’s in Social-

Valerie Juleson:             Master’s in Social Work. It’s a little different. It’s macro. My program, there are some wonderful people I’ve worked with who are clinical, and if a family needed that work, you’d say, more in conflict, I would get a clinician to work them through their private business, that would not be where I’d want to go.

Valerie Juleson:             Okay? I can do short term, very goal-orientated, goal-setting, objective steps. That’s on my mind.

Greg McIntyre:             Sure.

Valerie Juleson:             Somebody who has that gift to do long-term clinical social work, I admire them, it’s not my skillset.

Greg McIntyre:             Right.

Valerie Juleson:             Macro is, I work with the hospitals. I work with businesses, multiple-level businesses on how we best address this. I just wrote one proposal for Charlotte because they’re going to do a lot of money in housing. Okay? So I just sent them a proposal. I write proposals on, how do we address this? There’s so many dis-coordinate pieces. It’s like I took a jigsaw puzzle on the table, threw it on the floor and said, now go fix it.

Greg McIntyre:             Right.

Valerie Juleson:             We, the businesses that can make a difference are you, the geriatric social workers, the people who are, design the real estate, every place there’s a change-of-life evaluation happening, hospitals. We need to write a unified program. If we don’t, the predators already have.

Greg McIntyre:             Right.

Valerie Juleson:             They’re already on every level, and figuring it out. Shame on us, who are the protectors, who haven’t done the same.

Greg McIntyre:             Right. So, thinking, in the sense that I’ve worked with you before. You were part of a guardianship case and the family hired you to go look at a facility for them, to talk with the family, to, yeah.

Valerie Juleson:             More than that. The family did not know where or how or what to do.

Greg McIntyre:             Right.

Valerie Juleson:             So they, themselves were chasing the wrong tasks.

Greg McIntyre:             They were trying to bring grandmother back in the family, control of grandmother back from the state, right? And let the family be instrumental in her care and in her life.

Valerie Juleson:             It was a dramatic worst case, best case.

Greg McIntyre:             Yes.

Valerie Juleson:             Okay? It was a very dramatic worst case, best case, what can be done, and I think when we walked out of there you were like, whoa. But basically, all of what I do, or 90% of what I do, is homework before I walk in.

Greg McIntyre:             Right.

Valerie Juleson:             Just like you.

Greg McIntyre:             Right.

Valerie Juleson:             It’s all done when I walk in.

Greg McIntyre:             Sure.

Valerie Juleson:             And then I listen.

Greg McIntyre:             Right.

Valerie Juleson:             And usually, you don’t have to get hardcore. Sometimes you do, but you don’t usually have to.

Valerie Juleson:             And so that was just a unified, it wasn’t me. It was all of us. You were there.

Greg McIntyre:             Sure.

Valerie Juleson:             And you were the law, you were the muscle if they got ugly, okay? And you were. And you were sitting there, and you were the or else. Okay? And that’s the role you’re comfortable in.

Greg McIntyre:             But well, but it doesn’t need to, it doesn’t, hearings like guardianships don’t have to be that. In fact, when you have done your homework beforehand, when you have a license, whether you have a geriatric social worker that goes out, that looks at the facility where grandmother will be staying, that interviews the family, that comes in and really gives an objective report.

Greg McIntyre:             That can put a family on par with social services, who also has a social worker that’s going to come in and also give a testimonial, which may or may not be biased, right, in a certain way, to achieve a certain objective.

Valerie Juleson:             Right.

Greg McIntyre:             So it really gives the family more options, and power, and strength, and I guess, more of a foothold in the hearing.

Valerie Juleson:             And it’s objective.

Greg McIntyre:             Sure, sure. We want to keep it objective and [crosstalk 00:22:55] there are bad things.

Valerie Juleson:             And I’m not getting a paycheck from anyone.

Greg McIntyre:             So, exactly. So I think that in that hearing, you brought a lot to the table because of that. And that’s very powerful with your background experience and education as well. So, let’s say that I’m a family, and I have a loved one who needs care. Let’s say they need long-term care or, are we trying to figure out, I don’t know, whether care is needed or what to do. And I call you and I say, you were recommended to me, can you come in and help direct us. On a macro level, what are you going to do when you come in?

Valerie Juleson:             When I come in, and the first thing I’m going to do, hypothetically, with your grandparents, okay, first thing I’m going to do is really talk to you and hear what you have to say, and if there are other people involved; maybe you’re concerned, but it’s your wife who’s doing the primary care for her parents.

Greg McIntyre:             Sure.

Valerie Juleson:             So I’m going to hear, what does a typical day look like? What are the challenges? Where is it showing up? Then I’m going to say, what is going on medically? A lot of times, we can have a UTI that looks like dementia.

Greg McIntyre:             Oh, sure you could.

Valerie Juleson:             It could be a medical problem, it could be a vitamin B12, we could have anemia, we could have a whole set of medical. So when was the last medical assessment done, okay? So we need to check medical. We need to check, maybe someone in the family needs the support. Maybe the grandparent is befuddled, but we, you know, we can set up the remedy that is even greater.

Valerie Juleson:             Grandpa’s wandering, he thinks, or grandma, thinks she has to meet the bus. There are GPS bracelets that will ring in your house the moment grandma goes off the property.

Greg McIntyre:             Right.

Valerie Juleson:             You don’t want to limit them, they love their garden. You can’t lock them in the house. Once they leave the property, your phone is going off in your pocket.

Greg McIntyre:             Right.

Valerie Juleson:             See, there are technological things, there are medical things that we need, if you, we have to crop our picture and see, where do we zoom in the most obvious and easiest to attack. We start with that. Okay? And can we adjust it? Maybe there are things we can do if there’s more priority, and the family’s priority, to keep grandma at home, then we’ll look at a modular. Maybe she can’t live alone anymore because she’s going to burn the house down. But maybe we could put a modular, where it has medical, it’s called a MEDCottage, but there’s something in the backyard for grandma’s setting. And she- [crosstalk 00:25:42]

Brenton Begley:            Speaking of home-

Valerie Juleson:             If she doesn’t have to spend her whole thing.

Brenton Begley:            Right. Speaking of home, too, I have an in-home signing that I’m going to, right, today, and so I do have to leave you guys but Valerie, it was very good to meet you and you know-

Greg McIntyre:             We’re going to wrap it up. I have had a great experience interviewing Valerie today, and I’ve had a great experience working with her as a geriatric social worker in the past, so Valerie, I think, would be excellent for any estate planning or elder law attorney out there to work with, and to refer families to, as well as for families to individually call when they’re not sure what to do, because Valerie has the experience to help that family through specific situations. So, I think it’s a good time to bring it to a close, as well. Brenton, thank you very much and I want to make sure that we put Valerie’s information on the screen. Valerie is a geriatric social worker with a Master’s in Social Work. I could talk to you all day about the differences in social work [crosstalk 00:26:48] because there are so many differences out there and different types of social workers, and your phone number to reach you-

Valerie Juleson:             Is, it’s (704) 497-6714. It’s probably best to reach me by email because I am, if I’m in a meeting, or I don’t recognize the number, I will not always pick up.

Greg McIntyre:             Okay.

Valerie Juleson:             Okay. The email is

Greg McIntyre:             So,, and I will put that information out there. I love the back of her card, Brenton, it just has her initials.

Brenton Begley:            Ah (affirmative).

Greg McIntyre:             That’s really cool.

Valerie Juleson:             I’m just part of the team.

Greg McIntyre:             You’re part of the team.

Valerie Juleson:             Because it’s going to take a whole team. It takes the doctors, it takes lawyers-

Greg McIntyre:             You certainly are one smart lady because it’s not easy to get to Columbia University.

Brenton Begley:            Right.

Greg McIntyre:             Is it, Brenton?

Brenton Begley:            You’re right.

Greg McIntyre:             You think? Definitely a respected college. Hey, thank you Brenton, for being on, and guys, if you need to contact Valerie again, it’s Valerie Juleson, geriatric social worker, MSW, Master’s of Social Work, phone number (704) 497-6714,, great way to contact her and ask more about social work and geriatric social work.

Greg McIntyre:             I’ve mentioned there are a lot of other social workers out there in North Carolina. I know a lot of them that would love to be doing what you’re doing too.

Valerie Juleson:             I actually had, before I left, retired here, I had a whole group I trained.

Greg McIntyre:             Really?

Valerie Juleson:             Because I needed-

Greg McIntyre:             I bet you there’s a lot of social workers that will reach out too. Care, too.

Valerie Juleson:             I hope so, because it is unique. It is very rewarding, and not under anyone’s thought.

Greg McIntyre:             Well, I thank you for doing everything you do. I’ve known families you’ve helped, and it means a great deal, so thank you.

Valerie Juleson:             Thank you.

Greg McIntyre:             Thanks, guys. Thanks, Brenton. And we’ll see you next week for the Elder Report.

Intro Vocalist:               (singing)


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